Aristocrat's Mafia #3: Dennou Coil (Topic)

wth is starcraft

The subtitle still states when the first night end, not when the day ends...

In regards to Raitaki being infected, how should we determine which Programmer will protect him and which one shall synthesize a metatag?

None.

Quote from

Wing Zero

I agree. AZ is a shitbird.

That's not a very nice thing to say about an entire state of people

Quote from

Generalpie

I abstain. There really isn't solid evidence of TiKels being mafia.

There's plenty of evidence. If the Investigator's Disassembly shows he's guilty, as I'm sure it will, consider yourself the next prime suspect.

Quote from

Roy

Wow, really? You guys have Lotus die on the first turn again? That's messed up.

I actually agree, I've missed playing with LoTu)S, he hasn't been very active since he won the first TKG. Now he's back, and people keep killing him off immediately.

I'm actually going to be kind of mad if you turn out to be Mafia, since you killed him last game. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't have any reason to single him out like that every game

Quote from

Roy

But Lanth also died, so they're at least trying to play fair.

From the way it's written, and the way Lanthanide talked about it before and after, it seems he used his killing power on himself.

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Roy

So our opponents are fair but heartless. Sounds like Azrael!

Aww thank you :kame:

However, I don't think these guys are playing fair, as evidenced by eliminating a player who was also eliminated immediately in the previous game. It's in pretty bad taste, considering how many targets there were to choose from.

Quote from

OlimarandLouie

In regards to Raitaki being infected, how should we determine which Programmer will protect him and which one shall synthesize a metatag?

I think they should probably contact Raitaki and have him sort it out for them. This is a risk in the sense that he could be Mafia pretending to be infected. If there is an Investigator (other than the one checking TiKels tonight) free, they should test Raitaki's infection status, just to make sure he's legit. If it comes up positive, that should prove his innocence.

Quote from

Azrael

Quote from

poison_us

So what you're basically saying is that he's guilty regardless of how he plays, shows up post-lynch, etc? Because I remember the time you pulled this crap on me. I literally had no idea there was a countdown at all, and poof! I was mafiazors.

So what you're literally saying is that you're blatantly defending someone who is obvious scum. He was fully aware there was a countdown. The conversation was taking place in real-time.

This is a lie. As stated in the conversation I was on my phone, and unable to interact quick enough. From my end I saw you say that you wanted me to tell my role, refreshed, and you were already at "1". Intentionally too brief for me to react.

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Also, it doesn't matter what he shows up post lynch, since he immediately hinted at the fact he'd show up as Town. It's not like we should be surprised if someone shows up as Town, since all Null show up as Town no matter what, and it can be assumed that Mafia have some capacity to change displayed roles, since all Beguilers so far have been able to do that in some capacity.

Covering your tracks so no matter what the outcome you're not held culpable. Mafia are certainly capable of tampering with information. This also means that they could be capable of tampering with results from cyberforensic investigators to show anything! Not just town. Assuming you're town, you know anything could be possible, yet you choose the one side of the information that would benefit your goal of killing me.

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I guarantee he is either Mafia or Null. Read the conversation. He was begging me to agree to his terms, to ally and help him win, until I told him I'd kill him if he was scum. Then he said I was disgustingly dishonest and refused to tell me anything else. If that isn't the most obvious scumtell ever, I don't know what is.

I just had problems trusting a person who abused my trust in the previous game. That's why I was being restrictive with my information and showing distaste. Not because I'm mafia. I'll outline this more in the coming section.

You're so positive that it's going to show that I'm a mafia alignment when I die. Maybe there's a reason you were acting so certain of the mafia's powers. :unsure:

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As I said in the shoutbox already, you wouldn't have acted so weird when I told you I was Mafia unless you knew I was lying. You had no problem allying me when I was Mafia last game, and you were Town. That indicates that this time you knew I was lying.

You were fully willing to team up with me. If I wasn't already sure you were scum, I'd have probably agreed to it. The last reaction test was just icing on the cake.

Last game you framed your contract with the perspective that you were a townie and you were risking allying a mafia. You purposefully manipulated my perceptions to trick me into lowering my guard while simultaneously abusing my trust in you that I've built over the last few games. Here's a copy of the agreement for the LAST mafia game. As well as some interesting tidbits I found from the shoutboks that link back to my previous thoughts (in blue).

Like page 212 and 216 of the shoutboks as of 12:39 P.M. today

As you can see I was the same level of apprehensive about it, with an hour of deliberation and then continued stipulations following that. I hadn't even been backstabbed at that point. This time azrael didn't ask if I wanted to ally him, he just did it and claimed mafia of all things. I was skeptical, especially with the increased aggression in his methods that he put against me. I was super uncertain of how to react against such a blatantly hostile and manipulative player. I mean really, a player who just tricked you into a contract is now asking you to very rashly make decisions? Come on.

This bit in blue is a completely valid train of thought. But notice how it is not present in azrael's current thought process. He assumes that certain aspects of the game are going to be reliable (namely the results of gravedigging). This contradicts itself.

You gave me equal rights in the contract only if I was mafia, which you were sure I wasn't because you were mafia. This is dirty.

Lol at demon.

No I wasn't. I spent like 12 hours trying to figure out what kind of trick you were putting me through. Irony is that I still fell right into it.

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Quote from

TiKels

Azrael lead the last game through me. All the things that I posted were azrael's writing. This time he's trying to kill me.

Right, last game I did play quietly through other people, because I had something to hide. Now I don't, so I'm playing actively and coming for you directly. This is the benefit of getting an expendable role.

All roles are expendable, so no, your thoughts don't apply. You can't just say "oh my role doesn't matter" and have your actions not be held against you. As per my coincidental conversation with aristocrat...

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[12:38:46 AM] 明智光秀: If the game was actually jacked up due to Lanth being a douchebag, I would've reset it
[12:38:59 AM] 明智光秀: However, I chose not to, because he needs to take responsibility for his own actions
[12:39:11 AM] 明智光秀: and it is still perfectly winnable for any of the three sides
[12:39:20 AM] Tella Lie: winnable, yes, but not playable as intended
[12:39:41 AM] Tella Lie: game was intended to have whatever role he had
[12:39:48 AM] Tella Lie: ekspert hacker or otherwise
[12:40:09 AM] 明智光秀: The game is still quite playable as intended
[12:40:29 AM] Tella Lie: i find demon's guest appearance quite humorous
[12:40:44 AM] 明智光秀: Assuming Lanth is indeed an Expert Hacker who killed himself day 1, this is equivalent to mafia killing him day 1 by a lucky hit
[12:40:52 AM] 明智光秀: the game wouldn't be jacked up in that case
[12:41:03 AM] 明智光秀: although it would be more difficult for town
[12:41:14 AM] Tella Lie: it's definitely a possible occurance
[12:41:16 AM] 明智光秀: This mafia setup is designed with a large margin of error

Once again dispersing information that is actually false to help substantiate your claims.

I vote No Lynch
I vote No Lynch

Edit: After going to this thread and reading my post, azrael immediately went to his PMs and was "Online: Is composing or reading a private message."

Be careful with what he's saying if he messages you. He's going to do anything to try and get himself out of this situation.

Edit2:Take note of this ekschange.

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Azrael directly avoided the question because he knows that it can only incriminate him. He has used this strategy before (I didn't know this, thanks poison) and is now avoiding any commentary because of how incriminating it is.

Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Oct 9 2012, 5:34 pm by TiKels.

"If a topic that clearly interest noone needs to be closed to underline the "we don't want this here" message, is up to debate."

-NudeRaider

Quote from

TiKels

Edit: After going to this thread and reading my post, azrael immediately went to his PMs and was "Online: Is composing or reading a private message."

It had nothing to do with you or your post. I haven't even read your post. Cry about it :kame:

Quote from

TiKels

Be careful with what he's saying if he messages you. He's going to do anything to try and get himself out of this situation.

I'm not going to do anything because I'm not in any situation.

I didn't bother reading your novel of a post because I don't care what you have to say. I know I'm not guilty, and I know you are.

I just realized I figure out you're guilty on the first day in every Mafia game that you're Mafia. You are really bad at this.

Squirm more, scum :kame:

If you can't defend yourself against my post then why is anyone listening to you?

"If a topic that clearly interest noone needs to be closed to underline the "we don't want this here" message, is up to debate."

-NudeRaider

I don't need to defend myself against your post. You didn't add anything new or relevant.

I know this because there is nothing new or relevant to add. I really didn't read your post, aside from the edit at the end.

I'm not guilty, so there's no way you could incriminate me.

You are guilty, so there's no way you could prove your innocence.

It's that simple.

Squirm and die, Mafia kid :kame:

Magic box god; Suck it Corbo

I abstain.

Quote from

Wing Zero

I abstain.

We don't know what the Beguiler's powers are, so we don't know what their capability for altering vote outcomes is.

This isn't the time to go "oh, he's going to die anyways so I'll just play it safe and abstain". He may very well be able to overturn the lynch.

He is scum. If you don't feel like reading it, the short version of our conversation was:

TiKels - "Hey, let's team up! I'll tell you my role if you swear to help me win!"
TiKels - "Do you agree?"
Me - "Yes."
Me - "Unless you are Mafia or Null, then I'll kill you."
Me - "So what's your role?"
TiKels - "You're so dishonest."
TiKels - "It's disgusting."

The only way this reaction makes any sense is if he's Mafia or Null.

Vote to lynch TiKels to reinforce our voting numbers. I don't want the vote being overturned by some Beguiler magic, if it can be helped.

If you're worried that it will make you seem guilty if TiKels is somehow innocent, don't be. I'll take responsibility in that case.

However, I'm positive he's scum, and considering the incriminating behavioral analysis against him, I'll consider anyone who isn't voting for him to be potential suspects.

If you're Mafia, forget about saving TiKels. Vote for him to die or reveal yourself by defending him. Those are the only choices.

I vote TiKels.

Win by luck, lose by skill.

Well I got infected too.

As for voting, not sure what's going on in regards who is guilty and stuff so for now,

I abstain.

None.

TiKels why do you use "ks" instead of "x?" "Eckschange," etc.

I vote TiKels. But really, Azrael, you are so boring.

None.

wth is starcraft

His 'x' key is broken, it's in another thread.

I abstain.

None.

I would have believed Tikels, if not for the fact he was fairly late with that quote post and that he also faked a whole Skype conversation last game...And if Tikels if you thought Az was acting really weird and scummy, why didn't you just stop and tell someone earlier?

It doesn't make sense that you still continued to do back-and-forths with Azrael despite how bad (you claimed) he was acting.
I vote Tikels

There is another problem that I can see. There is no reason to believe there are 2 original Nulls in the game. When I was talking to Aristocrat pre-game about Null, he even explicitly used the term "the original Null". I request a Cyberforensics Investigator to do a V-Scan on Leon tonight. If he shows up clean, I propose we make him our lynch tomorrow. If not, Shrine Maiden can just purify him next Night.

None.

An artist's depiction of an Extended Unit Death

Quote from

Raitaki

There is another problem that I can see. There is no reason to believe there are 2 original Nulls in the game. When I was talking to Aristocrat pre-game about Null, he even explicitly used the term "the original Null". I request a Cyberforensics Investigator to do a V-Scan on Leon tonight. If he shows up clean, I propose we make him our lynch tomorrow. If not, Shrine Maiden can just purify him next Night.

Azrael's game had 2 Zombies, and Aristocrat based this game on that. I bet the role distributions are identical to scale, especially because the Shrine Maiden role makes it easier to reverse Illegals.

OH SNAP, REASON'D! Don't should about me.

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Quote from

Raitaki

I would have believed Tikels, if not for the fact he was fairly late with that quote post and that he also faked a whole Skype conversation last game...And if Tikels if you thought Az was acting really weird and scummy, why didn't you just stop and tell someone earlier?

It doesn't make sense that you still continued to do back-and-forths with Azrael despite how bad (you claimed) he was acting.
I vote Tikels

It has already been said that azrael faked that skype conversation, not me.

Ask azrael if all the shouts are true. He hasn't disputed that simply because he can't. If you would like I can put it in the form of saved shouts on here or screenshot it if that is allowed. I don't think i can do it all on one page though unless you can increase the number of shouts view-able per page. It was just a lot easier to copy and paste each section rather than making 10 saved shouts and claiming they were all linked together. Writing that post in itself took almost an hour.

I didn't start coming up with conclusions about azrael until after i looked at it closely. Azrael was just acting in bad faith with his entire act, although not necessarily scummy. Honestly not even sure if azrael is scum.

"If a topic that clearly interest noone needs to be closed to underline the "we don't want this here" message, is up to debate."

-NudeRaider

Back* from the grave

Quote from

TiKels

Long crymore post

Really? You're pulling at any string possible to stay alive. Even if I thought you were completely innocent (I don't; I trust nobody, not even my proxy detective [yet]), that's a bit much.

Though Azrael may have slipped up last night in saying that...oh fuck it I'll quote it. Bottom up for laziness.

Quote from name:Azrael">http://www.staredit.net/?p=shoutbox&view=1811]Azrael -- There's also some slim chance Mafia can fake their death at lynch or something, in which case the Investigator would find out.
Azrael -- However, I doubt the Investigator has anything better to do than verify that anyways.
poison_us -- Either way, the town investigator should look at his corpse.
Azrael -- I'd argue that, since he failed behavioral analysis so spectacularly, he's almost certainly scum, and therefore showing up as Mafia will mean he's actually Mafia.
Azrael -- Your point is valid.
poison_us -- You're insinuating you know that TiKels will only show up as Mafia if he's mafia, otherwise he may be hidden as a townie or may in fact be a townie...
poison_us -- Wait a second... Az... "I hope he shows up Mafia so we don't have to waste a night action Disassembling him." Care to explain this?
Azrael -- I hope he shows up Mafia so we don't have to waste a night action Disassembling him.
Azrael -- So delicious.
Azrael -- Watching TiKels squirm.

I do find this a bit scummy, though it's nowhere near enough to start a bandwagon lynch (for me).

Oh, and to anybody who gives a flying should about about what I have to say, please remember that it's entirely possible that both TiKels and Az are mafia. Just food for thought, before the lynch.

Quote from

Roy

Don't should about me.

I should about Roy. Why are my should abouts not being counted, ffs?

Quote from

Wing Zero

I agree. AZ is a shitbird.

I agree, and so I must vote TiKels. I mean should about Tikels. And Roy.