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[2017-5-14. : 11:22 pm]  Swampfox -- Do you think it was appropriate to voice your opinion on the matter in that particular thread? Do you think this would have been better suited to shoutbox? I feel like some of the animosity may be stemming from this.[2017-5-14. : 11:21 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: Broflamingo This is what I'm trying to get at: Who I am, what I've done in the past, or what I personally think is not relevant no matter how much your feelings say they are. The only relevant thing is my argument. And since you can't respond to that, you can only tell me about your feelings and about what you feel is relevant, then you aren't presenting a case of why I'm wrong. You're presenting a case why you're mad about me voicing my opinion. And if you're looking for the silencing of dissenting opinions you've come to the wrong place. <----This, you are just lacking a certain level of awareness man. We all have self-reflect sometimes. Like you wished me luck, I wish you luck on some self-reflection.[2017-5-14. : 11:19 pm]  Excalibur -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: Excalibur Ex i can't be more anymore honest with you, you just came off as salty and being negative. It's a visceral feeling, and sure maybe there is some merit to your argument but your past actions just throw any of that out the window. This is what I'm trying to get at: Who I am, what I've done in the past, or what I personally think is not relevant no matter how much your feelings say they are. The only relevant thing is my argument. And since you can't respond to that, you can only tell me about your feelings and about what you feel is relevant, then you aren't presenting a case of why I'm wrong. You're presenting a case why you're mad about me voicing my opinion. And if you're looking for the silencing of dissenting opinions you've come to the wrong place.[2017-5-14. : 11:18 pm]  Moose -- NudeRaiderNudeRaider shouted: Lanthanide Strawman. And in this case Ex is correct. People are misrepresenting what he said. For example lil-inf: He argued that Ex is trying to stop people from mapping, when in Fact he said the opposite. It's UNDERSTANDABLE that, because of Ex's tone, people thought his remark "have at it" is meant sarcastically. But if you look at it closer you realize he said it because he was upset. What's to misrepresent? He told him straight up never to even imply that TS could be a positive for SEN. If some random did that in a production or assistance thread for another map, I'd like to think our mods would bop that in a heartbeat.[2017-5-14. : 11:18 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: Mini Moose 2707 Argue that TS could be beneficial to SEN, have a net gain impact, and that it won't be a repeat of last time. Several people have already presented points he could make as part of that argument. Ex, i sound like a broken record but: THERE IS POWER IN NOT SAYING A WORD.[2017-5-14. : 11:17 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: Mini Moose 2707 Argue that TS could be beneficial to SEN, have a net gain impact, and that it won't be a repeat of last time. Several people have already presented points he could make as part of that argument. Ex i can't be more anymore honest with you, you just came off as salty and being negative. It's a visceral feeling, and sure maybe there is some merit to your argument but your past actions just throw any of that out the window.[2017-5-14. : 11:16 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: I see why you're trying to incorporate politics as an example but I don't think it actually applies. Honestly Bro, I'll say it for the fifth time: Address my argument. Do it. Stop going THE TONE THOUGH. Its like when people we're going BUT HER EMAILS during the election. Address the argument or back down. Just like Hilary you come with a negative stigma in this context, your arguments are overridden by your past actions. And I just disagree with everything that you said. Example, despite toxicity Moose and CAFG were able to curate some of the player base into benefits for SEN. I just don't think you are as smooth as them and it gives you bad image in this context.[2017-5-14. : 11:15 pm] Excalibur -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: What even do you want him to argue? That 8 years ago didn't happen? That's insane. Argue that TS could be beneficial to SEN, have a net gain impact, and that it won't be a repeat of last time. Several people have already presented points he could make as part of that argument.[2017-5-14. : 11:14 pm] Zoan -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: What even do you want him to argue? That 8 years ago didn't happen? That's insane. ya but it didn't tho in my opinion.[2017-5-14. : 11:13 pm] Moose -- What even do you want him to argue? That 8 years ago didn't happen? That's insane.[2017-5-14. : 11:12 pm] Excalibur -- I see why you're trying to incorporate politics as an example but I don't think it actually applies. Honestly Bro, I'll say it for the fifth time: Address my argument. Do it. Stop going THE TONE THOUGH. Its like when people we're going BUT HER EMAILS during the election. Address the argument or back down.[2017-5-14. : 11:12 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: ....But this isn't politics? And the context of you being a Leading figure here seems to be lost on you and some others. There is an awareness you appear to be lacking, and im saying this with an utmost respect.[2017-5-14. : 11:10 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: ....But this isn't politics? Seemed like politics/Beef to me. That long of a response and thorwing people/opinions about a map under the Bus. I mean dude, people aren't robots. The tone was negative, it was an old arugment, and it appeared you were taking subliminal shots at UU. Being somewhat politically savvy you could have worded that much better and left out the negativity, yet you opened a can of worms that divided people. It became political.[2017-5-14. : 11:06 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: I guess my main gripe is this: Why is everyone talking about my motives/tone/preference/the fact that I'm staff and not my argument? Why is all of that relevant but the actual argument I presented is not? And this goes back to my original point, there is power in just not saying a word, especially one colored with negativity.[2017-5-14. : 11:04 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: I guess my main gripe is this: Why is everyone talking about my motives/tone/preference/the fact that I'm staff and not my argument? Why is all of that relevant but the actual argument I presented is not? You guys seem to forget people are humans. Yes the logic is sound blah blah, but perceptions, gut feelings, and history play a part as well. No matter how much you argue with Logic, people will see through veil of "ITS JUST A LOGICAL ARGUMENT". Guess why its called politics huh.[2017-5-14. : 11:02 pm] Broflamingo -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: Broflamingo If thats the case then why are you accusing a Staff member who illustrated his point of being dishonest / needing to read between the words for their actual intentions? Is your opinion that a Staff member by default is a dishonest person with a motive they don't wish to admit? Or are you still assigning that to me personally over my dislike for TS? You know what, again, you don't guys don't get it. You can hide behind logic all you want, but there is context and history. And your argument comes from an emotional place that is negative toward TS.[2017-5-14. : 11:01 pm] Excalibur -- I guess my main gripe is this: Why is everyone talking about my motives/tone/preference/the fact that I'm staff and not my argument? Why is all of that relevant but the actual argument I presented is not?[2017-5-14. : 11:00 pm] Excalibur -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: NudeRaider Also with all credited due respect to EX, he is a mod. that comes with a degree of influence and power, it's not like hes some mad random throwing his two cents in. Everything is contextual If thats the case then why are you accusing a Staff member who illustrated his point of being dishonest / needing to read between the words for their actual intentions? Is your opinion that a Staff member by default is a dishonest person with a motive they don't wish to admit? Or are you still assigning that to me personally over my dislike for TS?[2017-5-14. : 10:57 pm] Broflamingo -- NudeRaiderNudeRaider shouted: Lanthanide Strawman. And in this case Ex is correct. People are misrepresenting what he said. For example lil-inf: He argued that Ex is trying to stop people from mapping, when in Fact he said the opposite. It's UNDERSTANDABLE that, because of Ex's tone, people thought his remark "have at it" is meant sarcastically. But if you look at it closer you realize he said it because he was upset. Also with all credited due respect to EX, he is a mod. that comes with a degree of influence and power, it's not like hes some mad random throwing his two cents in. Everything is contextual[2017-5-14. : 10:56 pm] Excalibur -- The only thing I'd add Nude is that due to my long standing reputation here I feel like I get less of a fair shot at having my viewpoint considered. "Its just Ex being an impassioned zealot again. He's obviously being disingenuous. He can't have a factual point of why this is a bad idea."[2017-5-14. : 10:54 pm] Broflamingo -- NudeRaiderNudeRaider shouted: Lanthanide Strawman. And in this case Ex is correct. People are misrepresenting what he said. For example lil-inf: He argued that Ex is trying to stop people from mapping, when in Fact he said the opposite. It's UNDERSTANDABLE that, because of Ex's tone, people thought his remark "have at it" is meant sarcastically. But if you look at it closer you realize he said it because he was upset. Inferno was right, just because he didnt say "I HATE TEMPLE SIEGE DONT MAP IT" doesn't mean the tone or the subtext isn't discouraging or throwing shade toward a Map/Project/Person.[2017-5-14. : 10:53 pm] NudeRaider -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: Dem0n This. NudeRaider Nude that maybe true but that wall of text was not relevant to what the main topic was about. Again, it's like the logic maybe sound but there was a emotional impetus to throw negativity into the convo. was mainly replying to the shoutbox convo, because everyone seemed to be arguing about a different thing.[2017-5-14. : 10:52 pm] Broflamingo -- Dem0nDem0n shouted: It's like if I had an emotionally charged response to someone asking how to set up a bot and cited how flooded op SEN got 7 years ago and how that should never happen again. It is not relevant. This. NudeRaiderNudeRaider shouted: So yes, when Ex is mad he's not the most eloquent of persons, but if you actually try to understand his point it's not that hard and there's no reason to become butthurt or open 20 discussion topics on what Ex didn't even try to say. Nude that maybe true but that wall of text was not relevant to what the main topic was about. Again, it's like the logic maybe sound but there was a emotional impetus to throw negativity into the convo.[2017-5-14. : 10:50 pm] NudeRaider -- * Ex's recommendation on that matter was to not associate SEN with TS to prevent it.[2017-5-14. : 10:50 pm] Dem0n -- It's like if I had an emotionally charged response to someone asking how to set up a bot and cited how flooded op SEN got 7 years ago and how that should never happen again. It is not relevant.[2017-5-14. : 10:48 pm] Dem0n -- Ex had no business bringing any of that up in that thread. That's it. Nothing else. /discussion[2017-5-14. : 10:48 pm] NudeRaider -- So yes, when Ex is mad he's not the most eloquent of persons, but if you actually try to understand his point it's not that hard and there's no reason to become butthurt or open 20 discussion topics on what Ex didn't even try to say.[2017-5-14. : 10:48 pm] NudeRaider -- THIS is the point y'all should argue (and some did): Will TS cause and influx of toxic members? And if yes how, and maybe how to prevent or mitigate it. Ex's recommendation on that matter was to prevent it was to not associate SEN with TS.[2017-5-14. : 10:48 pm] NudeRaider -- Upset because of past experiences where TS has brought several people to SEN that weren't behaving up to par. Bro interpreted that (falsely) as a personal beef with TS itself. The distiction is minor, but important: The emotions stem from the fear of history repeating itself. 'The beef' is not with TS, its maker, the players, it becoming popular, or people improving on it.[2017-5-14. : 10:48 pm] NudeRaider -- LanthanideLanthanide shouted: if you think there are multiple people misunderstanding what you've written, then actually the problem is your writing Strawman. And in this case Ex is correct. People are misrepresenting what he said. For example lil-inf: He argued that Ex is trying to stop people from mapping, when in Fact he said the opposite. It's UNDERSTANDABLE that, because of Ex's tone, people thought his remark "have at it" is meant sarcastically. But if you look at it closer you realize he said it because he was upset.[2017-5-14. : 10:30 pm] Moose -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: Mini Moose 2707 Fuck it, looks like i will have to get in the dirt and figure out how to work triggers. Gonna get this map made one way or another. Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: SMH, gotta spend 5 hours searching for shouts so I can quote myself now Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: MasterJohnny Yeah, turns out when you have a lot of obscure executables that sometimes trigger false positives in malware scanners, you get flagged. There we go.[2017-5-14. : 10:23 pm] Zoan -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: When i try to download trigger editor plus from SEN it gives me a warning and I cant download it wtf... Voyager7456Voyager7456 shouted: Gotta disable the Chrome safeguards. There's nothing dangerous about it, but Google wants to protect you from DLing obscure unsigned executables. don't listen, it's a virus[2017-5-14. : 10:23 pm] Voyager7456 -- Gotta disable the Chrome safeguards. There's nothing dangerous about it, but Google wants to protect you from DLing obscure unsigned executables.[2017-5-14. : 10:23 pm] Moose -- SMH, gotta spend 5 hours searching for shouts so I can quote myself now[2017-5-14. : 10:21 pm] Broflamingo -- When i try to download trigger editor plus from SEN it gives me a warning and I cant download it wtf...[2017-5-14. : 10:17 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Gotta make a TS corporation that pays any money generated from the map or its work down the chain of creators LMAO Fuck it, looks like i will have to get in the dirt and figure out how to work triggers. Gonna get this map made one way or another.[2017-5-14. : 10:14 pm] Lanthanide -- LanthanideLanthanide shouted: strange really, if you were going to take a very polished map and put your own spin on it, wouldn't you try and do a good job of it? maybe they thought they were I guess the other point though, is that I'd spent months working on it up till that point. pretty difficult for anyone to come in and make changes and have their first version be good; my first versions weren't great[2017-5-14. : 10:13 pm] Moose -- Gotta make a TS corporation that pays any money generated from the map or its work down the chain of creators LMAO[2017-5-14. : 10:12 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: I didn't have any trouble opening it. WTF, send it in then![2017-5-14. : 10:10 pm] Lanthanide -- ExcaliburExcalibur shouted: @Lanth remember Cactaur by chance? He thought his maps were as good as anyones. nope, likely before my time[2017-5-14. : 10:08 pm] Zoan -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Broflamingo It's possible there's some inefficient stuff. There's almost 3x as many lines of triggers in G3F vs M8 How do u know? do you have an unprotected ver of G3F?[2017-5-14. : 10:06 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Broflamingo It's possible there's some inefficient stuff. There's almost 3x as many lines of triggers in G3F vs M8 I figured that. Intuitively the map feels buggy, slow, and unresponsive at times. Alot of feedback from the TS community confirms this. On iccup it was like playing in molasses.[2017-5-14. : 10:04 pm] Moose -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: Mini Moose 2707 Moose im no programmer but for someone reason the Map feels "slow" (g3f). I played C1f for comparsion felt super responsive and fast, just felt fast. No idea why. It's possible there's some inefficient stuff. There's almost 3x as many lines of triggers in G3F vs M8[2017-5-14. : 10:04 pm] Excalibur -- @Lanth remember Cactaur by chance? He thought his maps were as good as anyones.[2017-5-14. : 10:02 pm] Lanthanide -- strange really, if you were going to take a very polished map and put your own spin on it, wouldn't you try and do a good job of it? maybe they thought they were[2017-5-14. : 10:02 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Broflamingo Broflamingo Ya, put he name everywhere he could. Who would've thought someone who calls themself IAmGod'sGift would be so full of himself? LMAO Actual factuals.[2017-5-14. : 10:02 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Zoan It's a weird emotional attachment. Like, I wouldn't care if someone busted open IAGG's and did whatever, but M8 feels different for some reason. Moose im no programmer but for someone reason the Map feels "slow" (g3f). I played C1f for comparsion felt super responsive and fast, just felt fast. No idea why.[2017-5-14. : 10:02 pm] Moose -- BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: Mini Moose 2707 True story fam, except for his buddies. His version is widely panned among everyone, not gameplay wise, but the obnoxiousness of it. Plus its buggy as fuck. BroflamingoBroflamingo shouted: Mini Moose 2707 Even gameplay wise*, sorry typo. Ya, put he name everywhere he could. Who would've thought someone who calls themself IAmGod'sGift would be so full of himself? LMAO[2017-5-14. : 10:02 pm] Lanthanide -- never really got much popularity, especially since I implemented some innovative new features within a couple of months[2017-5-14. : 10:01 pm] Lanthanide -- they made some radical changes to it, and the quality just wasn't up to what I did[2017-5-14. : 10:00 pm] Zoan -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Zoan It's a weird emotional attachment. Like, I wouldn't care if someone busted open IAGG's and did whatever, but M8 feels different for some reason. Ya, it's your map, your decision.[2017-5-14. : 10:00 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Zoan It's a weird emotional attachment. Like, I wouldn't care if someone busted open IAGG's and did whatever, but M8 feels different for some reason. Even gameplay wise*, sorry typo.[2017-5-14. : 10:00 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Zoan It's a weird emotional attachment. Like, I wouldn't care if someone busted open IAGG's and did whatever, but M8 feels different for some reason. True story fam, except for his buddies. His version is widely panned among everyone, not gameplay wise, but the obnoxiousness of it. Plus its buggy as fuck.[2017-5-14. : 9:59 pm] Moose -- ZoanZoan shouted: idk, I wouldn't wanna be a dick to moose. It's a weird emotional attachment. Like, I wouldn't care if someone busted open IAGG's and did whatever, but M8 feels different for some reason.[2017-5-14. : 9:56 pm] Broflamingo -- Mini Moose 2707Mini Moose 2707 shouted: Ya, but there's a meme rule on SEN for some reason that we can't give you unprotectors even though you can google them LMAO I tried it on IAGG's it doesn't work. Dem0n even tried for (Really appreciate that) and it didnt work. |
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