Krayzee is just mad, don't bother trying to justify yourself.

Rive, wait til I have L4D2 to beat on expert okay?

Hehe. I just finished Hard Rain with my good friend (splitscreen) on Expert!

BEST. CAMPAIGN. EVER.

I'm mad? I've beaten them all on Expert (And Realism after) on another steam account. I know exactly what I'm talking about, and it's easier than the original game. The new weapons, and extra stuff like ammo types and laser sights all make the survivors overpowered (Laser sight + AK47 if not mentioning Sniper Rifle). Hard Rain appears to have more witches than usual, though.

Right, well I plan to buy it next friday on payday. It'll be awesome!

Will you help me beat some expert campaigns then? I got the Parish completed, it took less than three hours to accomplish which, for some reason, impressed this one guy that joined the game late in the campaign.

I have had some good Realism teams, but they usually all break-up after an hour or so in.

Wait for a week and I can do it with you!

For those of us who don't have the full game, what are the other modes like? I imagine that with realism, everything just does more damage, and scavenger sounds like survival but with supply hoarding; is there anything else to them?

Realism doesn't show where people are, so if you get lost, gg. There's a few more things that make it considerably harder.

Scavenger is the vs mode I think. The Survivors have to collect gas tanks to fill a machine, infected players must stop them. Each container gives additional time, if time runs out infected win. However if a survivor is holding a gas tank then time won't end and it becomes a game of knocking that container out his/her hands.

It should take you around one hour (Not at least one hour and twenty minutes) of a five level campaign (And several minutes less on four level campaigns). Three hours on expert means you shouldn't play expert, or you must get a better team.

From my personal assumption, AND experience, use the overpowered weapons and these tips:

My personal overpowered weapons to make it ridiculously easy (With maximized sensitivity speed)
Sniper Rifle (With Laser Sight to even ridiculously add more accuracy) -- Don't need to zoom in, you can fire from the hip and it doesn't have a spread whether you have a laser sight or not. (Valve must be pretty ignorant if Sniper/Hunting Rifle are just for sniping at long distances, because its use on close quarters are better than Auto Shotguns in my personal use)
Magnum (Despite how overpowered the Sniper Rifle is, I happen to use this weapon through the entire level even against Chargers)

Overpowered Automatic
AK47 (With Laser Sight)
Magnum or Dual Pistols

Anti-Tank (Seriously, just use the Magnum in the entire game while using the Grenade Launcher only on Tanks)
Grenade Launcher
Magnum
Molotov Cocktail or Bile Bomb (Not both, unless the Tank came out of the fire on the ground, and is ignited)
Adrenaline Injector

Traditional Shotgun Rush
Auto Shotgun (Spas-12 or Benilli M4 Super 90 AKA Combat or Tactical [with Laser Sight if you have the chance]
Dual Pistol (Or Magnum if you prefer it)
Pipe Bomb (Or Bile Bomb if you prefer it, but wipe them zombies out though)


I'll assume you have a good experience with Pipe Bombs and Molotov Cocktails, but the Bile Bomb is perhaps, the most constantly spawned in Dead Center. Use it often, especially against Tanks, but never on Witches. Also the Bile Bomb makes infected players nervous in versus/scavenge modes.


Be lucky that weapons reload much faster than the original Left 4 Dead, so you can finish reloading before the meter completes when someone picks you up while you are incapacitated (I noticed this on the dual pistols). Also, there are many weapon spawns (Most of which could be worthless when you have the Sniper) unlike the one spawn of three tier 2 weapons from Left 4 Dead 1. Don't worry if you're out of ammo, and each teammate can get an extra copy of what you use. Make use of the adrenaline injector to quickly pickup incapacitated survivors, and bring a defibrillator if you have green health (If your teammates already have first aid kits, and heal while you have a black and white screen, not the red zone [Only heal on the red zone if on the crescendo event or there's a Tank, otherwise use it sparingly]). First aid kits have a tendency to spawn quite often throughout the levels unlike the original Left 4 Dead. Take full advantages of these stuff of what Valve gave you, and make sure your teammates are not idiots.

Using boomer bile on a tank is a big no no as I have learned from my Left 4 Dead 2 expert playing. I watch so many people throw their bile jars at tanks, which spawns even more zombies, and, after the zombies deal a bit of damage to the tank, they all start coming after the players. With the tank still alive, it is complete suicide. I feel it is only best to use bile bombs when you want to rush. Just toss it and go. It is like a miracle cleanser.

I currently have three of five campaigns beaten on expert. All of which have been done with random teams. I might have been done already if I was not trying the final two on realism.

A big no no? Not to me. I just use the Sniper Rifle (No scope, tapping the fire button), Auto Shotgun or Magnum to finish the horde off clean. If not, throw a pipe bomb after; there are plenty of grenades scattered/spawned throughout the levels. The bile bomb attracts the horde a bit longer than the pipe bomb, and the horde will only come after you when the green mist is gone (And stick together, don't get divided). The bile bomb will certainly not kill the Tank, that's for sure; it will slow him down or stop his movement. The Tank in Left 4 Dead 2 is dumber, and weaker than the Tank from Left 4 Dead 1, so you don't always have to throw a Molotov or a bile bomb on choice (And it appears you won't throw a bile bomb). When he incapacitated one survivor, the incapacitated survivor will be picked up easily. The Tank barely pounds on the incapacitated survivors in Left 4 Dead 2 (As where in Left 4 Dead 1, the Tank will continue to pound on survivors in Expert while they are incapacitated), so that eliminates the worry of losing a teammate. Tier 1 weapons (Pump Shotgun, Submachine Gun) are quite effective against the Expert L4D2 Tank unless they are against the Expert L4D1 Tank. I like to point out that you should never use melee weapons during a horde attack in expert anyways, unless you are confident enough to shove them away and then kill them with the melee weapon.
Lastly, relevantly to the bile bombs on Tank: don't shoot the common infected when they are stopping the Tank but do shoot if you believe they pose a threat to you.

If anything to worry about in Left 4 Dead 2 would be the horde, and special infected combined (Cause double Hunters/Smokers could be a bitch during a horde, but is manageable to beat with coordinated players). Witches and Tanks are nerfed, so there's no need to worry about the bosses. The new toys makes survival too easy, even the bile bomb.


Irrelevant, but I have this sudden urge to point something out about the Tank. Click here. Yes it's Left 4 Dead 1, but I believe the same goes to Left 4 Dead 2 if I'm not mistaken.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Nov 29 2009, 10:02 am by KrayZee.

I love this game. I couldn't imagine it without jockey, spitter and charger. Though Charger is in need of improvement, it's far too easy to miss/dodge and get murked against a wall.

Despite the many criticisms I made about Left 4 Dead 2, I'm actually looking forward to the new DLC campaign called The Passing. Why? The Left 4 Dead 1 survivors are back in DLC. "New uncommon infected", new melee weapon (Sure, sorta redundant), and new firearm. I'm hoping it's not overpowered like the Magnum, and it better not be something ridiculous like an automatic pistol such as the Glock 18, or a Flare Gun igniting zombies (However, a burst shot would be nice).

It'd be nice to pick out of 8 characters on scavenge. I'm sure it makes no difference, but more the reason to have them.

I'm not certain if the L4D1 survivors are playable in L4D 2. So far, I heard the L4D 2 survivors will just "meet" them. Disappointing if that's the case.

L4D2 is a lot of fun, the game is worth it with or without the survivors.

I think the only fixes needed are:

Tank needs to be harder to kill, it's a lot of fun when they're around because of just how strong they are, but they don't last that long.

Boomer: In the online play the boomer is rendered useless and a suicide mission.

One shot kill, Easy Target, Slow movement, Low range and an average of 5 - 10 zombies coming in consecutive order and not simultaneously. I know it's a support class though.

Tank is tougher in the original Left 4 Dead, and his weaknesses were Molotov/Gas Can, and Auto Shotguns. In Left 4 Dead 2, he's been nerfed a lot: Using cars, dumpsters, carts, etc. to hit survivors does not incapacitate them anymore, Rock "Hip throw" (In L4D1, he throws the rock over his shoulders; The shoulder throw is much more accurate), less health, AI hardly crushes the incapacitated survivors (Where in Expert in L4D1, he'll crush a survivor in a few hits to kill them), and new weapons makes him significantly weaker. Grenade Launcher is not even fair when used against the Tank, which pisses me off at how totally imbalanced versus is in Left 4 Dead 2, and how significantly weaker the Tank is in Left 4 Dead 2.

Boomer is the infected where you require stealth and patience (And instant spawn behind a cover to vomit as soon as possible). He's hardly useless, and if vomit fails, suicide mission and clawing is the way to go. You simply don't know how to use the boomer if you consider him useless. Seriously, he is far more useful than the Spitter in Versus (Blinding + Sending horde > Creating floor lava that disintegrates really fast). Spitter hardly stops the survivors (Unless on Scavenge or incapacitated survivors), but the Boomer can. Smart survivors do not kill the boomer up close, and you should take advantage of that before they shove you away.

And note how AI Boomers comes around corners, on rooftops, in open ceilings, and etc.



Edit: http://steamcommunity.com/stats/L4D2/achievements/
58.9% of PC players have killed the Spitter before she is able to spit. 38.9% of PC players have beaten the Dead Center campaign (The first one). The most achieved achievement as special infected is Qualified Ride, where only 27.5% of PC players had achieved them.

The statistics clearly proves that a small portion of the "Left 4 Dead 2" community still plays the game while the rest didn't bother playing it again or ever tried finishing Dead Center during online, and I am right (I want to be wrong, but no). About a little over 1/3 of people who registered their Left 4 Dead 2 in their steam beaten the first campaign. As of today, 45.3% of PC players have beaten No Mercy in Left 4 Dead 1. Proves that the sales, while successful (Selling way better than L4D1), is bullshit because of lack of players playing. People bought Left 4 Dead 2 and didn't playing it again. Left 4 Dead 2's peak population is the same as Left 4 Dead 1's peak population before Left 4 Dead 2's release (19,950). But Left 4 Dead 1 had several more thousands players in December 2008 (About 20,000 to 30,000). However, today Left 4 Dead 1's peak population is now 5,617 thanks to the Left 4 Dead 2's efforts of dividing the community.

So, Left 4 Dead 2 is imbalanced, has redundant weapons (Excuse to say Left 4 Dead 2 has more weapons), Tank is significantly weaker, Spitter is useless on some occasions in Versus, Charger sucks if missing, and if used at crowded levels, daytime levels (Including non-creepy songs [Dark Carnival's intro song is cartoony because it used in The Simpsons Halloween Special]), doesn't have "Look down to see torso and legs" like the first game, weapon positions feel like glued to the right side of the face, constant weapon spawns, common first aid kit spawns, defibrillators, adrenaline, did not fix the stupid artificial intelligence of the survivors (They don't pick up grenades at all, nor gas cans during Scavenge/Dead Center finale), lame characters (Except Conman Nick), and the majority of people who bought the game did not dedicate to play it (L4D 1 is at larger margin with player dedication of playing it during its time). More players play on the Xbox 360 version than the PC version, apparently like the first Left 4 Dead. The boycott is more dedicated to Left 4 Dead than the people contributing to the high sales, which sickens me how people despises the boycott.
I'm still looking forward to The Passing if the L4D1 survivors are playable, and if it is at night time with creepy music.

Edit2: Lastly, Left 4 Dead 1 has more survival maps than Left 4 Dead 2.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Dec 17 2009, 9:34 am by KrayZee. Reason: sigh

I play scavenge because...

A) It's fun.
B) Versus is LONG.
C) The poppulation is down right stupid and survival is made harder by this.

As for your counter-arguement, I knew you'd accuse me of being inadequate, but I am not. I quite often boom on 3 to 4 people and get away. My main concern is 'the horde' you speak of. Not enough zombies come to deal a good amount of damage, even when incapped I am not afraid of boomers.

As for the spitter being useless, she most certainly is not. Her damage is exponent

ial. A carefully placed spit can bring opposing teams to a halt. However, I will agree that she is slightly underpowered. her acid radius could do with being wider to combat people jumping twice through it, but damage is fine.

Smoker is great.
Hunter is great.
Jockey is fine. (Maybe a bit faster? but not much. Recharge after incap!?)

Charger is great for damage and bowling people over, but missing is all to easy considering he has an arm the length and width of a survivor.

Versus is suppose to be long, and is about two times longer than campaign if both teams are good.
Survival is not harder with more weapons added, and with defibrillators to revive players.

Boom on 3 to 4? Don't you mean "vomit"? Or are you suggesting you don't vomit, and you get yourself exploded and get away? Also the boomer, if I recall, is nerfed in Left 4 Dead 2 with reduced zombie count. That or, you are playing the Xbox 360 version which has reduced zombie count (Or so I heard). There's a reason why Valve added melee fatigue to Left 4 Dead via patch, and becomes included in Left 4 Dead 2. Purpose being that vomit/crescendo is able to penetrate and damage survivors.

From L4D Wiki: (On Boomer)

• The range of its vomit attack is shorter.
  
• The recharge of its vomit attack is slightly faster.
  
• The Boomer moves slightly slower.

Spitter is more useless in Versus than she is on Scavenge. On Scavenge, her spit can ignite gas cans, and prevent the survivors fuel to add time. In Versus, she is only useful during crescendo, blocking paths, killing standing idiots, killing incapacitated survivors, stop campers and finales. She is useless because of the fact how the spit disintegrates much faster than she reloads her spit, the survivors just walks away and around the spit. You'll eventually find the Spitter to spit on survivors who loses control: Constricted, Charged, Pounced, or Steered than she attacking survivors lone wolf (That is, if the survivors suck, then lone wolf Spitter is able to incapacitate them).

No. People are already bitching about him the most. He's good as it is. He doesn't need any buff, he's already a midget (Forcing survivors to aim down), is able to steer one survivor backwards really far, steer survivors off the edge/cliffs, etc.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Dec 17 2009, 3:25 pm by KrayZee.