I think the best solution is a simple one.

When you kill a warp gate, simply treat it as if the creatures which would have spawned from it are killed equally by the team. So if marines and a 3 person team, add 2*MarineKillScore to each player on that team's killscore. And etc.

This way, the bonus for killing a warp gate is that they don't have spawns to distract/interfere/kill you, but it still acts as if you had killed them.

The bonus for killing a warp gate thus doesn't need to be too significant, a minor boost would be enough.

I don't know if anyone else thinks this (but i think they do) in the newest version of 1.5 out there, rine has 11 + 3 atk again... that's kinda too strong for rine. I'm thinking maye give him like 6-8 + 3 ups because +2 makes him not so nice and with that it gives him a harder starting, since rine completely owns at the starting.

Rine is fine with 11+2

why cannot i play in single mod?

It's meant to be multiplayer

Lawl. I know it's been awhile since you gave me the map... But I have two things to say:

1: The only thing SEVERLY wrong (that I've seen) with this version is the lack of income from assimilators.

2: The marine is not overpowered. It's so easy to facerape it's rediculous. If anything, lower it's HP, not damage.

By the way, this version is much better than Moose's. Lul. And thanks for winning@life, UHU.

Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Apr 22 2009, 8:02 pm by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Keep this in PMs, and please stop swearing so much.

The income from assimilators has been decreased by 1/3 ...
A lot of people seem to agree with that because assiming seemed too important to win..

One thing I noticed tho was that the buildings may now be a bit overpriced for the current flow of money :S... Maybe instead of doing 20/100 (it was initially 30/100)..i'll do 25/100 so it becomes 1/6 slower.. but we'll c

Now for the important thing...
I need some help with the terrain!!
I handed the terrain to xYoshix right now, and he's been doing a great job and cutting out some strips of land and implementing some island and stuff...
However, I still feel that the new terrain is too bland at the bottom middle... and I also feel that maybe you guys have some crazy cool ideas for the terrain.. So I'm letting you guys know now that I'm in need of a new terrain, which could be made by any of you =D...

and btw.. i'm absolutely useless with terrain :C... SO PLZ HELP!

I would still like to help with the terrain.

If you see my other posts, I suggested giving the option to everyone so we could discuss the new terrain. I hope you post it so that we can.

Unholy i would like your newest version if you are releasing it as you said in your recent Posts in the original temple siege thread.

I sent you a pm in regard to this and some other concerns but i'm not sure if you lost it or what so i am repeating it here.


once the warp gates are killed the location is moved and they still continue to spawn but due to the location being placed over a place where they cannont spawn (most likely water) the cannot create units at coods message appears. This is quite annoying if the temple doesn't go down fast enough or if one gate is killed relatively early in comparison to others. Would be helpful to either stop them from being created or create them at a space which immediately removes them once they are created.

also more expirimenting with the volt and lurker has caused me to see that the volt can completely avoid lurker mines. He can pass right over them without activating them while the mech vulture cannot. I can only assume this is either a bug or meant as yet another counter to lurker from volt. His spells already disrupt the lurker enough if he is harassing so i don't understand why this is necessary if is meant as a counter.

Also i'm sure i mentioned something else in that message but cannot remember if you do find it i suggest you look to see my other suggestion or whatever it was if you can find it that is.

@Shredder ... okay i will =)
@killer_sss
i've already fixed the 1st thing.
secondly, i am not sure why volt wouldn't be hit... he should be.. i'll doublecheck on it..

lastly, it turns out that when mutant casts L3 and then L2 while the lurkers are out, he'll place a Sandtrap ...
and I am unable to pinpoint the trigger which needs to be preserved so the day/night cycle will continue ><''

I am trying my best to not make it too boring. I am currently changing the bottom-middle part. It shouldn't be boring anymore. I'll let you know as soon as it is done. Telling me specific places to fix would be of assistance too. It was hard fixing mneox's mess...

All I have to say is, our team had the entire map full of assims, and I was barely getting anything. It's really easy to kill sims, and the fact that they cost 30 is annoying, because it takes like 5 minutes to gain it back. -.- In that time, they could kill all the sims, with any team (barring like...Medic, Phantom in a 2;2).

Doodedoo. Also, Phantoms L4 is lolingly weak, considering it only turns like 12 hals into lolweak+7damage ghosts.
The only chars that come to mind that this actually owns (l4-wise-ownage), is DM. Er... That's it I guess but to be fair, she DOES have Ensnare, Storm, Mael, and Feedback which eat hals, however, those require her to have the energies, whereas the rest of the chars can easily run, have a dodgy-move, or can just plain tank it (Anything Large/Medium). LULK

Dead assims obviously don't give income. Just because you don't have 30 ups by first night, does not make them too weak. It's called balancing.

Well.. it is either I lower the price of buildings, or increase the flow of minerals from assims by 1/6 from what it is currently.

and @ Yoshi ... okay i know you've been working hard on it ..

Please do not lower the cost of buildings... Putting civilians into money and getting Reaver or Dragoon spawners is a broken enough strategy as it is.

first off you can exp while they kill your sims. You don't need to cover the map to recieve great benifit. If you spread them out especially away from spawns they waste more time killing them than can make up for it in exp. Personally the assim rate is perf as is. It pumps out cash plenty fast.

as for your whining about phantoms L4 being to weak thats insane. Unless they are hp whores with big units you be able to kill them with relative ease. Even with the 1/4 dmg problem one can easily kill a 2khp goon with ups but then you don't know how to sim so i can understand how you find it weak. Not to mention you should be in top 2 exp spots if played properly. Either way if your haviong trouble killing opponents use it to feed during day time and at night you can pk by surrounding them when they retreat. Chances are they will be weak enough to kill by then and with night they wont see you until its 2 late.


Unholy IF you mess with sims at all i think you should fix the bat's refineries 30 minerals for 70 armor is total hurt against some chars. I can rush L3 and sim the entire map with no consequences especially with a partner already siming protected gysers. Even against the characters that can kill them if you get them out fast enough and protect them they can prove extremly deadly. I would really like to see these increase back to 35mins per.

Rofl! Who said anything about 30 ups by first night? Jesus christ. You call it balancing, WHERE THE HECK IS THE BALANCE WHEN YOU SIM 300 MINERALS INTO THE GROUND, TO HAVE THEM DIE WITH A 90MINERAL RETURN? LOL?????? There's no balance in that. And on top of that, their team just gained 40 exp! ZomG!
Ohnoes! They missed two spawn waves to rape 60 of your minerals down the drain, albeit you got a return of 15-30, and they gained 8 exp! Whatever will they do with the two missing spawn wave kills? Oh woe is them.
lolumad? You get owned by a phantom L4 as warrior or something? There was no whining in my post. There is, however, much much sarcasm, as you can tell... Or not, I don't know your level of perception, w/e. And fyi, d00d, I always sim, if someone on my team doesn't first. Hence my annoyance@slow slow income.

See, I'm a little confused. So I'll do a simple recap!
Assault: OHMYGODHALS -run- Speed>hals
Mech: LOLHALS
EarthDemon: LOLHALSVSMYSIZE SIMPLEDODGYL1
DarkMage: OHGODHALS>MECAUSEISLOW canCloak@night
Sumoner: Rofl I'll just resummon those!
Archer: Ohnoes! 75%damage to me I can run away easily!
Mutant: RoflSlowHals If I can't tank 5 hits I'm a newb no-HP mutant as is.
LightMage: Ohnoes! Hals! -Casts L1 as he casts L4-
Volt: LoLMagnet Gl getting enough hits to punch through his Large-Sized, yet tiny HP?
Warrior: lolplz If a warrior can't tank almost all of of phantom L4, they're n00b.
Assassin: Ha! What was once here is not! The general agreement is Assassin should only do shit @night, which I think is stupid, but I'm tired of arguing with people that fail@logic.
Psion: That tickled LOLYOUMISSEDCAUSEINVINCE.
Engineer: LOLMP? (EMP) Can Run fastar then slowlawlz
Medic: Hm... Medic shouldn't be fighting, so ohnoes...(at least not that late in game) canCloak@night
I think that's them all. o.O
As you can see when the L4 is cast, it takes a horrendous amount of time for them to change (AND attack), and they don't all change@once. So this it all but impossible to have them all target a char fast. And in that time, you can either dodge, or run away, laughing@ the fact that the new L4 ghosts stop moving! How hard to run away from! Ohnoes! Hell I usually just stick with L2 till the end-game.
lolwut. How about like 60 for one? Ffs, Engineer already has lol can-splash-attack, Can-Multi-Lane-L1, can mutli-irrad-rine/zealot-L2, can lolArmoredSim>at least 6 chars, can-lol-the-map-with-mines-l4? But I care not, cause in general, simming is useless if you're not playing newbs.

kthnxbai... Something 'bout my posts makes people so mad.

Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Apr 22 2009, 7:59 pm by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Flaming, immaturity, obnoxious, etc.

I also believe that, although phantom's l4 takes a time to cast, it also has a good range and does a lot of dmg. It can be somewhat countered, but not easily by all heroes, just like all the other heroes in the game.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Apr 22 2009, 7:57 pm by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Off-topic.

OHMYGODHELLDONTKNOWWHATMEANSITOMG@HAXSLOWHALMOVEDODGE!

Seriously.. half of that made no sense...

Lowering the sims by 1/3 isn't really that much, considering that the old assims pumped out too much money. The whole reason sims' income rate was dropped was because the game depended too much on them. Even if the sims are dieing...shouldn't you try to stop them? There is no need to make sims outside of bases anyways. Those sims provide a reasonable income that gives the players a bit of a boost.

Phantom is fine the way it is. By the time you get spell 4 you will have..say...20 ups. Each ghost would do 50+140. Thats pretty good. Multiply that by 12...thats 2280 dmg. Thats pretty good if you ask me. Good enough to kill heroes like mana engineer, mutant, light mage, dark mage, and maybe even volt considering it has shields. The range of the ghosts are pretty good and can snipe heroes from afar. Some of them even fire twice, which adds on to the damage.